There are lots of different techniques out there, so I thought I'd ask everyone what is their preferred method for teaching the box turn and why? Let me know what you think of the others out there as well--what advantages or limitations they may have. Do your clubs teach using exclusively one method, or do you utilize many? Do you find that different types, sizes, breeds benefit from one method over others?

I train a turn with a board. I place it on the ground with jumps in front and teach the dogs to go over and back. I then move the board up the box still with jumps in front (dog is always in front of me, I do not want them going around me - I think allowing a dog to go around the handler teaches a wide turn instead of a tight one). When the board (and the turn seems to be sticking) is about half way up the box, I place the ball on the ledge of the box. I want the dogs to learn from early on that a turn involves the ball and since there is more "box" a turn is easier. I may use my body to push the dog out some to get the butts on the board but I pretty much stick with this method until the board is lying flat against the box. Once the dog is getting the ball off the ledge while getting the ball I will remove the board. I have found this may only take a couple weeks with some dogs and then I can start working with the dog on catching a triggered ball instead of a dead ball.

If a dog does not seem to do well with my normal method I will try other methods until I can find something that works.

I think each dog needs to be treated and trained as an individual. Dogs have their own learning methods and I try not to force my way. Dogs within the same breed may need to have a more hands on approach while others may prefer more hands off. It really depends on the dog in the long run.

In my area most people are training for fun only and may never plan to compete so I try to make training fun for them and the dogs without forcing techniques. I do give many warnings about certain things and if there is even a slight chance they will compete I let them know I will not retrain if they chose to not train a turn.

My own dogs training starts when they are pups and have found great success with them from the beginning training my way.

Our team uses a few variations based on the technique of Julie Norman/Jenkins from Fur Fun on the East Coast.

We start with a propped box. We have two training boxes, one is an old competition box, the other is a practice box with the angle and matting of a real box, but without the ball mechanism. Both boxes are propped up on the front edge with a gutter. We start with having the handler approach the box at a walk, with their dog on leash, and using food or a ball, to encourage their dog to go around the handler, putting at least one foot on the box. From this point on, our goal is having the dog feel comfortable jumping up onto the box with all four feet (either two feet at a time, or all four at once, depending on the size of the dog). We start with the dog circling the handler, but quickly move away from this. As Kim said, it can cause wide turns. If dogs do begin turning wide, we use props to teach the dog a tighter turn.

As we get more reliable performance on the box, we begin teaching the dog to pause as they come off the box, in a 2 on - 2 off position reminiscent of Agility contact training. From here, we teach the dog to use his back feet to push off the box. We alternate pause training with complete on/off swimmer's turns. This is when we tell our handlers to begin using a word for turning on the box.

Next, we add in distance. We have two different techniques to add distance. If the handler is comfortable with clicker training, we use a clicker to teach the dog a send away to the box. By this point, we usually need to add in a prop or other training aids to help the dog remember to jump on the box and off again with all his feet, instead of just hitting the box with one foot. We might also use a ball to get the dog to leave its handler and run to the box.

We add in the ball at different stages of box training depending on the dog and his ball interest.

I swear by Hup-Backs. Jersey had a perfect box in a month using them. There have been dogs in our club for two years who are still working on their box, having used other methods.

When I first started, my trainer had one way she taught us: start at a wide angle from the box, have a jump board and a cone in front of the box, and run the dog to the box quickly, get them to jump over the jump onto the box, then the person standing behind the box would quickly throw a ball away from the box, and we'd run with the dog to get the ball.

Past the first part of doing it, we would send the dog to the box from a wide angle, still with a board and cone in front of it. Gradually we would lessen the angle the dog was sent at until we were directly in front of the jumps, then we would slowly add jumps in to and from the box. All of this with the jump board and cone. My dog's box turns were non-existant the second the jump board and/or cone were removed, and weren't great even with them there.

I have since started training with another team for extra practice, and much prefer their method of box training (and I like the results their dogs have too).

The method I more recently learned is closer to what most of you seem to use, using a jump board to train a quick over-and-back motion, then do the over-and-back onto a board, and then slowly raise that board until it is at the same angle as the box. I already see a drastic improvement in my first dog's turns, and my newer dog is doing great using this method.

I also like the board method, as 2devils explained. That is how my dogs learned. Since moving to Florida I have not seen it used at all.

I've actually developed a new training method for box turns, which completely eliminates the need for props in front of the box at any point in training. It involves using a kind of snub nosed flyball box, and a training board built specifically for this type of training. So far, I've tried it with three dogs (starting at the beginning of this month) and all three are much farther in their training than the other dogs in class using the board method of training. One was even offering very nice turns all on her own after less than 5 minutes of training this.

Take a video for us.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eg6EQSdsXD0

Not the best video ever, but it shows the basic idea. The dog being worked with has never had flyball training of any kind before, and the video is of her first two times working with the snub nosed box training setup, with the two sessions about 15 minutes apart.

This dog is now on the highest level of the board, which is the same slope as the front of the box, doing beautiful turns while getting the ball off of velcro. Next step is trasitioning her onto the actual snub nosed box.

That's a cool training box! We've also done a similar thing by laying a target board flat on the ground and then propping it up little by little until it's fully standing. Another similar technique I've used is to prop up the actual flyball box so it is like an agility "table" (this depends on the style of box you have, whether or not it will work this way). The dog learns to jump onto the box/table and off again. Then slowly drop it back down in increments until it is in the proper position. Although for an agility dog you'd have to be careful and use a different command so the dog only relates the task to flyball. Linda